Edward Snowden's interview: 10 things we learned

(CNN) -- Traitor or patriot? Low-level
systems analyst or highly trained spy?
Slammed by top U.S. government officials and
facing espionage charges in the United States,
former National Security Agency contractor
Edward Snowden described how he sees
himself during an interview with NBC "Nightly
News" broadcast Wednesday. And he defended
his decision to leak documents about
classified U.S. government surveillance
programs .
We've heard from Snowden a few times before,
but the NBC interview with anchor Brian
Williams inside a Moscow hotel was his first
on an American television network .
Here are 10 key points from the
interview with the 30-year-old
former NSA contractor:
1. Snowden thinks he's a patriot.
"I think patriot is a word that's
thrown around so much that it can
be devalued nowadays," he said.
"Being a patriot doesn't mean prioritizing
service to government above all else. Being a
patriot means knowing when to protect your
country, knowing when to protect your
Constitution, knowing when to protect your
countrymen, from the violations of and
encroachments of adversaries. And those
adversaries don't have to be foreign
countries."
That assessment drew a sharp response from
U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry, who spoke
with NBC earlier Wednesday.
"Patriots don't go to Russia. They don't seek
asylum in Cuba. They don't seek asylum in
Venezuela. They fight their cause here," Kerry
said. "Edward Snowden is a coward. He is a
traitor. And he has betrayed his country. And
if he wants to come home tomorrow to face
the music, he can do so."
2. Snowden says he was trained as a spy.
U.S. President Barack Obama famously
referred to Snowden as a hacker last year , and
other officials have described him as a low-
ranking analyst. That's misleading, Snowden
said.
"I was trained as a spy in sort of the
traditional sense of the word -- in that I lived
and worked undercover, overseas, pretending
to work in a job that I'm not -- and even
being assigned a name that was not mine,"
Snowden said.
"Now, the government might deny these
things. They might frame it in certain ways,
and say, oh, well, you know, he's a low-level
analyst. But what they're trying to do is
they're trying to use one position that I've had
in a career, here or there, to distract from the
totality of my experience."
3. Russia isn't where he expected to end up,
but he's managing.
"I personally am surprised that I ended up
here," Snowden said. "The reality is I never
intended to end up in Russia. I had a flight
booked to Cuba onwards to Latin America,
and I was stopped because the United States
government decided to revoke my passport
and trap me in the Moscow airport."
There's a culture gap, and it's been an
adjustment.
"But even though I didn't choose to be here,
even though circumstances really trapped me
here, I can adapt. I can live life as an
American more or less. That's the beauty of
the Internet is that we're no longer tied to our
communities by physical connections," he
said.
4. Like a lot of us, he's been spending his free
time watching old episodes of "The Wire."
"I'm really enjoying it," he said, though he
added that the second season is "not so
great."
5. He's not happy about some things the
Russian government is doing.
Snowden says he has no ties with the Russian
government, and he isn't happy with some of
its policies.
"It's really frustrating for someone who's
working so hard to expand the domain of our
rights and our privacy to end up stuck in a
place where those rights are being challenged
in ways that I would consider deeply unfair,"
he said.
There's no good reason, for example, for a
recent law requiring bloggers to register in
Russia, he said.
"I can't think of any basis for a law like that,
not just in Russia, but any country," he said.
"The government shouldn't regulate the
operations of a free press."
So why doesn't he do something about it.
"There's so much that needs to be defended
here in Russia, but I'm limited by my inability
to speak Russian, and so on. It's an isolating
and frustrating thing."
6. It only takes a cell phone for spy agencies
in the United States and other countries to
find out a lot about you if they want to.
And that's even if you're just Googling
something simple, Snowden said, like a sports
score (Williams told Snowden he'd recently
searched for the score of a New York Rangers
game).
"The NSA, the Russian intelligence service, the
Chinese intelligence service, any intelligence
service in the world that has significant
funding and a real technological research
team can own that phone the minute it
connects to their network," Snowden said.
They can turn on a phone remotely if it's off,
he said. And even a detail like a Google
search for a sports score can reveal a lot
about you.
"You probably speak English. You are
probably an American. You are interested in
this sport. They might know what your habits
are," Snowden said. 'Where were you in the
world when you checked the score? Do you
check it when you travel? Do you check it
when you're at home? They could tell your
pattern of life. Where are you doing these
activities? When do you wake up? When do
you go to sleep? What other phones are
around you? Are you with someone who's not
your wife? Are you someplace that you
shouldn't be?"
7. He wants to return to the United States
someday.
"If I could go anywhere in the world, that place
would be home," he said.
But he responded with a series of questions
rather than specifics when asked what he
missed about home.
"What don't I miss? What would you miss?
What wouldn't you miss?" he said. "I miss my
family. I miss my home. I miss my colleagues.
I miss the work."
8. So why doesn't he come back to the United
States to face charges? Snowden says that's a
fair question, but an ignorant one.
Because he was charged under the Espionage
Act, Snowden says he has no chance to make
a public defense of his case.
"You are not allowed to argue based on all
the evidence in your favor because that
evidence may be classified," he said.
"When people say, 'Why don't you face the
music?' I say, 'You have to understand the
music is not an open court and a fair trial.'"
9. Why did Snowden leak classified
documents? He says he had no choice.
"The reality is, the situation determined that
this needed to be told to the public. The
Constitution of the United States had been
violated on a massive scale," Snowden told
Williams. "Now, had that not happened, had
the government not gone too far and
overreached, we wouldn't be in a situation
where whistleblowers were necessary."
The U.S. government, Snowden said, is using
the threat of terrorism "to justify programs
that have never been shown to keep us safe
but cost us liberties and freedoms that we
don't need to give up and our Constitution
says we shouldn't give up."
10. He says he tried to go through official
channels before leaking information but met
dead ends.
Among the people he contacted, Snowden
siad, was the NSA's general counsel office.
"I reported that there were real problems with
the way the NSA was interpreting its legal
authorities," Snowden said. "And the response,
more or less, in bureaucratic language was,
'you should stop asking questions.'"
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• Reply •
Joe California • 9 hours ago
I am a liberal but agree with my libertarian
friends that this man is a patriot. The CIA and
NSA were way out of line and needed to be
called out. No one else had the guts to do it,
but he did. He appears to be an exceptionally
brave and intelligent young man who had the
best interests of the American people in mind
when he did this. He is a brave defender of the
US Constitution. Thank you, Ed Snowden, and
one day you will come home and live in
freedom. By the way, the Espionage Act
should be found unconstitutonal, and the
Patriot Act as well for that matter. The actions
of the CIA and NSA were also
unconstitutional. If Obama had guts, he would
do the right thing and pardon Ed Snowden.
115 △ ▽
• Reply •
BB • 8 hours ago > Joe California
No need to apologize Joe. A liberal is one who
believes in the liberties of all people, liberty to
their own decisions and proper limits to power
over them. Just because a liberal believes
that the people can come together to form a
government for common good & welfare does
not mean he should worship the same govt.
when it violates its cause, purpose &
commitment to assuring state security,
tramples on freedoms & rights or creates vile
systems ripe for abuse.
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• Reply •
James B • an hour ago > BB
There is more to the political spectrum than
liberal and conservative. There is authoritarian
and libertarian. There are libertarian
conservatives and authoritarian liberals. Mass
surveillance is pure authoritarian, and has
little to do with either liberal or conservative.
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• Reply •
Alexander WJ • 2 hours ago > BB
no a liberal is someone who thinks big
government should guarantee them a good
life... corporations looking for handouts and
bailouts are more liberal than conservative...
tea party would rather see giant banks
bankrupt. Liberals are the ones who think they
should be allowed to make mistakes and have
government pick up the tab. They don't want
liberty to make their own decisions, they want
the right to make their own decisions...
difference being demanding to do this or that
without having worked hard to gather the
resources to fund those decisions.
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• Reply •
derpstermcgee • an hour ago > Alexander WJ
The founding father's were classical liberals.
Liberal and Conservative have come to mean
two very different things in the context of
American politics than in any other context.
In America
Liberal=left=socialist
Conservative=Right=Capitalist
In most other places they have a different
metric because the linear one side or the other
thing really is pretty pathetic and only serves
to let one side say we are good and they are
bad. Basically what you just did there, the
idea that you can split the world into two even
groups and so concretely apply these values
to them is absurd at best.
Some places use a square or diamond, others
use a circle. Because there are people on the
right, who call themselves conservative, who
want big government, and people on the left
who want less government. The dichotomy of
simply doesnt work.
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• Reply •
thinkclearly67 • an hour ago > BB
You are joking, right. A liberal believes in the
liberties of all people? LOL. wow. enjoy your
koolaid.
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• Reply •
Guest • an hour ago > thinkclearly67
No I'm not joking. Liberals believe in liberties
for people, not in forcing them to follow
religion, rules that they don't feel like
following. That's liberty in thought, word,
action.
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• Reply •
Joe • 30 minutes ago > Guest
So liberals hate Obamacare? What kind of
"liberty" is being forced to continuously
purchase a product from a company because
you are living or else be fined?
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• Reply •
JB Smith • 21 minutes ago > Joe
Obama care is in place to give the government
access to your medical records. They have
begun genocide in Virginia. They are
implanting innocent citizens with biochips and
murdering them with the active denial system.
They target our military veterans. The Virginia
state police are the largest domestic cell of
murdering terrorists in the nation. They call
the heart attacks natural causes, but if you
check out their bodies, you will find the
biochip and know they were murdered.
▽
• Reply •
KimZeee • 11 minutes ago > JB Smith
Ok, don't forget the tinfoil hat. They don't
need Obamacare to have access to your
medical records. Who are they allegedly killing
and why? If they are trying to reduce costs,
why not bump off seniors - they use more in
Medicare and Social Security costs and easier
to believe they would die from heart conditions
or other natural causes. What a nut.
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• Reply •
thinkclearly67 • an hour ago > Guest
LOL. Hilarious.
1 △ ▽
• Reply •
thatnormaldude
• 43 minutes ago
> thinkclearly67
A classical liberal is essentially the same as a
modern libertarian. The most liberal person in
Congress right now is Rand Paul. Feinstein
and her party would be considered, by the rest
of the world. liberal democrats (and some
socialist). However, the media in the US has
shortened it to "liberal" instead of "liberal
democrat", bastardizing the original meaning
of the word.
2 △ ▽
• Reply •
Guest • an hour ago > thinkclearly67
What's so funny?
1 △ ▽
• Reply •
Joe • 28 minutes ago > Guest
A liberal trying to sell being a liberal, without
mentioning racial pandering/division and
government handouts.
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• Reply •
blag • 18 minutes ago > Guest
The rattling of his empty skull.
▽
• Reply •
quietwoman • 6 hours ago > Joe California
I am liberal.The guy is scum.
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• Reply •
Joe • 27 minutes ago > quietwoman
Just the deep, well thought out, meaningful,
insightful and unbiased analysis one would
expect from a liberal.
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• Reply •
BOB • 4 hours ago > quietwoman
Amen!
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• Reply •
thinkclearly67 • an hour ago > Joe California
He is a traitor.
9 △ ▽
• Reply •
Alexander WJ • 2 hours ago > Joe California
yes... and the next guy to get the US nuclear
launch codes and put it on twitter gets a gold
star!
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• Reply •
thinkclearly67 • an hour ago > Alexander WJ
Snowden has made it ok for them to do that if
he is forgiven. He is a traitor. Period.
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• Reply •
That Guy • 7 minutes ago > thinkclearly67
And you're a blind puppet that would rather
live in ignorance of what your own government
is doing to infringe upon your own privacy and
civil liberties.
▽
• Reply •
David • 3 minutes ago > Joe California
You've been brainwashed by a high school
drop out with delusions of grandeur.
▽
• Reply •
alexinSH • 9 hours ago
Snowden did it for a better world!
He just wants to make US back to his real
core value.
He is a brave man and real hero.
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• Reply •
chattycathy123 • 2 hours ago > alexinSH
I am thinking that you fools who call him a
hero are only doing it because you feel that
somehow all this is President Obama's fault. It
doesn't matter to you that this all started 40
years ago. Nope, it only started when Snowden
came forward. That is all. I am thinking in two
years you fools will have a white man in the
white house and then, all your opinions will
change. All of them. And of course all
Americans because they have a freedom of
speech, you believe can say anything at all --
tell other countries -- like Russia -- about
what the U.S. is doing and of course they are
still heros. I believe Snowden would love all
you morons to come stay with him in Russia.
Hey, then you can have real freedom!
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• Reply •
SlothSays... • 2 hours ago > chattycathy123
Cathy, you are too chatty today. Are you so
concerned with snowdens status as a TRUE
american hero that you do not realize the
atrocities YOUR government commits against
your liberties every single day? Are you so
pre-occupied with the color of our presidents
skin to not understand that our government is
stealing from you, spying on your every move,
tracking your information, poisoning your
food, limiting your rights and basically
defecting from our constitution? Not to
mention...while we are told our rights and
liberties are being infringed upon to protect us
from "terrorists" the real terrorists are on
capital hill!!! the USG are the terrorists to the
rest of the world!!!
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• Reply •
ham89 • 2 hours ago > SlothSays...
Cathy is not too smart.
8 △ ▽
• Reply •
Diggerjohn111 • 2 hours ago > ham89
Typical. Someone disagrees with your narrow
view of the world,you accuse them of being
dumb. The arrogance is baffling.
▽
• Reply •
muad'dib • 41 minutes ago > Diggerjohn111
Typical. Someone on the internet is having a
conversation and you jump in and tell them
that calling names is wrong, and then proceed
to resort to name calling.
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• Reply •
derpstermcgee
• an hour ago
> chattycathy123
Yes and when we fount out about COINTELPro
people were upset and there were some pretty
high level resignations. This particular
program has only been active about 10 years
and was started under Bush as a response to
9/11.
Actually the funniest part of your post is that
before Obama took office something like 75%
of all Democrats were against the program,
Obama takes office and that jumps down to
around 50. Conversely the republicans were
primarily for the program until Bush left office.
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• Reply •
jfinch • 42 minutes ago > chattycathy123
I think you are confused. No one thinks this is
Obama's fault. People just realize he kept the
NSA programs completely intact after he took
office, despite his campaign promise of
transparency. I am sure Snowden would rather
be in Hawaii with his hot girlfriend, than in
Russia.
1 △ ▽
• Reply •
Mr.Pozzum • 2 hours ago > chattycathy123
The Tea Party would vote for Putin over a
black man.....Watch and see. As soon as the
President retires the tea party will go away
1 △ ▽
• Reply •
Marla Hughes • an hour ago > Mr.Pozzum
The Tea Party movement started under the
Presidency of GWBush and TARP. You really
should study up on recent history.
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• Reply •
iPheral • 2 hours ago > Mr.Pozzum
Nope, not a chance.
▽
• Reply •
blag • 16 minutes ago > chattycathy123
You think no one who hates what the NSA has
been doing knows this started before Obama?
You chat before thinking. Therefore only drivel
comes out.
▽
• Reply •
Carne Asada • 4 hours ago > alexinSH
Then destroy your cell phone if you really
mean it.
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• Reply •
Sjanders • 2 hours ago > Carne Asada
What is the connection between core values
and cell phones? Does that mean you can not
value community if you have a cellphone?
Does that mean you can not value education if
you have a cellphone? "Ah crap, I have a
cellphone, now I have to stop having values."
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• Reply •
Alexander WJ • 2 hours ago > Sjanders
doesn't stop other nations from hacking your
phone... not to defend the NSA but youre
targeting the ways we try and defend
ourselves from that external threat.
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• Reply •
derpstermcgee • an hour ago > Alexander WJ
That is kind of a cop out argument, the
argument isn't that we shouldn't have these
defenses its that we should have different less
intrusive defenses.
These massive intrusions have an absurd
potential for abuse that the NSA has
themselves admitted to, with thousands of
violations a year and agents looking up
personal relations. The FISC Court that
approves the NSA's requests has reprimanded
the NSA for their behavior in misrepresenting
their technology to get warrants they shouldnt
have and then violating the terms of those
warrants countless times. The NSA has no
idea what snowden took or how he took it.
The only reason the NSA needs such sweeping
power is to compensate for their own
ineptitude and that they could not get the job
done with the tools they had before even
though they could have.
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• Reply •
darkspire • 2 hours ago > Carne Asada
God, what a stupid thing to say. Why destroy
your cell phone if you really mean it? Because
the NSA is doing something they shouldn't be
doing? YEAH! MURICA! FREEDOM! Clearly our
american education system has failed you.
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• Reply •
thinkclearly67 • 2 hours ago > alexinSH
He is a traitor, a coward and deserves to be in
prison or shot for his crimes.
1 △ ▽
• Reply •
blag • 15 minutes ago > thinkclearly67
I wish we could do that to you for such stupid
posts.
▽
• Reply •
disqus_GSAq0pFyfD
• 23 minutes ago
> alexinSH
To label ES as a hero is disgraceful to the real
heroes of this world. The men and women in
our military that give their lives for our
freedom, the firefighters in California who lost
their lives (WILLFULLY) while attempting to
save hundreds of homes, the first responders
who lost their lives in the 9/11 attacks doing
what they CHOSE to do to save the lives of
others. Please, do NOT disgrace the real
heroes of this world.
▽
• Reply •
teebs • 10 hours ago
Right or wrong, what Snowden did was
necessary for so many reasons. We live day to
day with the understanding that the
government powers, have our best interests at
heart, when deep down, we all know that's a
lie. The government needs to have these
people in place for certain reasons but, can
then quickly deviate from a just cause to a
"any excuse to get a system in place".
Snowden leaked the files, but the reason he
was able to, was because of a US gov. that
has so many underlying secrets they're not
sure what is true anymore. I highly doubt that
as a "low level analyst" he was able to walk
into the "secret room with no passcode"
upload files and then walk out of a non-secure
building to book a flight to (fill in the blank).
This gov. is famous for one thing, how to cover
up a mistake. SIMPLE!
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• Reply •
winston • 8 hours ago
He is a patriot. Although what he did was
illegal what the NSA is up to, is far more
troubling, disturbing and illegal. He had a
moral obligation to speak publicly. And just
like today we consider Daniel Ellsberg, the
leaker of the Pentagon Papers, a patriot for
having done so. At the time he was called a
traitor.
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• Reply •
BB • 8 hours ago > winston
Whistle blowing by its very nature requires
some form breaking the law because often,
policies are in place to prevent such people
from speaking out. He's a patriot & hero.
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• Reply •
Alexander WJ • 2 hours ago > BB
whistleblowing involves breaking some laws,
whether federal, state or just contractual...
that doesn't make every crime that dislodges
information beneficial to the US public
whistleblowing.
otherwise, I'd just publish all of monsatos
proprietary technology files and include a few
lines about tax evasion ... and boom, I'm
helping their rivals and I would have immunity
via whistleblowing laws
▽
• Reply •
WstCstCtyGrl • 43 minutes ago > BB
Actually, there are specific policy's and laws
protecting whistle blowers within the
government - including in the classified
realms of the government. If Snowden were a
true hero he would have worked within the
system to raise the issues and concerns. He
did not. He instead leaked classified
information and jeopardized the lives of true
heroes. Their is nothing heroic or patriotic in
that. Furthermore, were he to return to the US,
he would undergo a trial through the
Department of Justice - which would include
processes for of addressing classified evidence
without it being disclosed to the public, and
risking the lives of true heroes and patriots.
▽
• Reply •
99rider • 7 hours ago > winston
Yes, and Daniel spent some time in prison to
earn that right to be regarded in history as
something more than a simple traitor.
4 △ ▽
• Reply •
hgflyer • 2 hours ago > winston
If what the NSA did is illegal, why haven't the
NSA Director or his boss, the President, been
indicted? If there were laws broken, then he
had a moral (and legal) obligation to REPORT
it...not to speak publicly: just like Daniel
Ellsberg and Bradley Manning. The United
States and its Constitution are greater
institutions than ourselves and our
governments, and one person's personal
feelings do not take precedence over them.
2 △ ▽
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Snowden: 'I was trained as a spy'
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